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Per Westermark
11/24/11 02:49
Read: 597 times

Msg Score: +3
 +3 Good Answer/Helpful
#184882 - You are still assuming you know what other people think/do
Responding to: Richard Erlacher's previous message
Richard Erlacher said:
Per Westermark said:
One thing is that different people have different views about what is a good climate to work in.

Another thing is that a mobile phone isn't just a device where teenage girls can walk around chatting with their friends all day.

Many people don't have a wrist watch. They use the mobile phone.

That's news to me! I don't know anyone who doesn't have at least one wristwatch.

It's a generation shift thing. All people who pick up their phones and look at it don't check if they have received an SMS/IM/Mail. They may just want to know the time.

A number of phones have an extra, monochrome, display just to be able to constantly show the time without the need to turn on the power-hungry back-lit color display.

Many people don't have a calendar/time planner. They use the mobile phone.
Many people don't have an alarm clock. They use the mobile phone.
Many people don't have a phone directory. They use the mobile phone.
Many people don't have a pocket calculator. They use the mobile phone.
Many people don't use a traditional mail program. They use the mobile phone.
Many people don't ...

I'm not sure why anyone would bring these items to work with them. I've never seen a need for an alarm clock at work. There's a clock on the wall. I don't expect people to sleep on the job, so they don't need an alarm. We have a phone book at the office. Every employee has at least one calculator (computer) sitting on the workspace in front of him/her. That provides not only the calculator, but a clock/calendar and an email program. They also have a telephone on their desk, and it's one with standard sidetone, so they don't find it necessary to shout.

Still refusing to see things through other peoples eyes, and try to figure out their view on things.

An alarm is not just an alarm to wake up. It's also a
- Time to take insuline shot - no not me. just an example.
- Time for that telephone conference call to England.
- Benny should have called me with the specifications on the PSU before lunch - he hasn't.
- Remember to check if the backup is done, so the tapes can be swapped.
- My time to get something nice for the afternoon coffee break - must buy on lunch break.
- ...

Your phone book is the one you got from the telco. It doesn't contain the 100 direct numbers to specific people at specific positions within companies all around the world. If I need to call the person responsible for the certification of a product, I want the direct number instead of having to go through the switchboard. The company doing the certification may even be in a different country - especially if the product is being certified for use in a different country. The office phone book don't have the number to a specific person in China, Canada or Israel, and a linked reference about current time zone difference.

You just have to realize that there are more than one way to skin a cat. Not all people are similar. Don't try to expect that everyone should do everything in the same way you do it. You don't pay people to be robots. You pay them to, independently, solve a problem in an acceptable way.

So forbidding someone to bring their phone is enough of a show-stopper for lots of people.

I don't spend my day SMS:ing or talking with friends. But the phone is a very major information hub - if I go to work and forget it at home, I'll have lots of real problems in front of me. Without calendar, to-do lists, contact lists, ... I would be very much hampered.

Perhaps you should learn to use a computer. They're VERY convenient.

Yes they are. Which is not contended. So youre reason to bring that up was to just be silly.

But let's play along. What is a "computer"?

- My phone runs Linux.
- It runs a program manager.
- It runs a scheduler.
- It has a file system.
- It has input interfaces.
- It has output interfaces.
- It has networking.
- It has backup functionality.

You know, I'm pretty sure I'm not too far off if I would claim that it _is_ a computer.
So yes, Richard. Thank you very much for confirming what I have said all the time. My phone can be VERY convenient.

Lots of companies have thrown out stationary PC machines and POTS phones. Using mobile phones and laptops, it's possible to do lots of work while on an airport, in a car or while visiting a customer.

I run a consulting business. If my people need to work at the airport or on the bus, they can use a notebook, assuming they have one. If people have to come to the office it's to interact with others or to use facilities they lack at home. If they need to handle personal business, they should do that elsewhere. I don't mind if they go outside to their car to shout and what-not on their cellphones. Oddly enough, my guys never have done that.

But you are running a "one man" consulting business. Even if you employ someone, you don't let them think. If they think, you would no longer feel you were in control. You don't hire competence. You just hire man hours.

Different people and different companies are at different positions on this sliding change in how we work. People at one end of the spectra may not interact well in a company that are at the other end of the spectra. But when working with information technology, we can't ignore the fact that new IT solutions can help us.

Until people learn to separate work and play, they have to be encouraged to leave their toys at home.

It's an age thing again. Anything you haven't learned to use is a toy. Maybe you should try one. You are using your prejudice to assume "work and play". Fact is that you have never really spent time learning exactly what advantages/disadvantages you can get with a really good smart phone. What you have done, is posting here - multiple times - how lousy they are and how lousy the development teams are. Just because your mind have defined that "phone" means "must only be able to make calls". And everything else are bugs.

I don't see it as a toy to be able to see all train times without need to boot a computer and connect to the net.
I don't see it as a toy to (re)book flights on the move.
I don't see it as a toy to pay parking with the phone.
I don't see it as a toy to be notified that the bus is 7 minutes late.
I don't see it as a toy to be able to send someone a document while on the run.
I don't see it as a toy to be called by someone about a problem, be able to pick up a datasheet for a chip and discuss a specific detail about it. Whenever. Wherever.

Cars got car stereos. Could be used for play. Or for safety/efficiency when we get traffic information.
Cars got air conditioner. Irrelevant luxury except that it has been proven that correct temperature in the car reduces the number of accidents.
Cars got turbo and direct fuel injection. Could be seen as sporty toy cars. Or as fuel-efficient cars with way lighter engines.

Everything did not peak at 1950. Lots of changes are for the better.

My guys don't use cellphones any more than I do.

I know. Oh, but I know. Wasn't hard for me to guess either.

They have POTS phones at home, or VOIP, and that's where they handle their personal business.

Assumptions, assumptions again. You are living your fantasies. You sneak in that "personal business" because you never once have been able to sit down and think about what commercial business advantages there could be.

They are, after all, adults.

That's the kind of argument people use when they don't have arguments. Something that may look strong, but is totally bull.

I work with solutions where the customers are willing to pay money to get information to their mobile phones. Where the customers have an economic incentive to get information to their mobile phones. Yes - living, adult human beings that have economic incentives to pay for functionality available in their phones.

Ever used an elevator/lift? Ever heard about anyone getting stuck in one? You see it as a problem that you may press a button in the lift car and someone - the technician closest to you - get a message in his phone telling him how to drive to get to where you are stuck? Don't know how much you have been out traveling. But I live in europe. Our city streets aren't numbered. So you either know where a street is, or you don't. But the person who are stuck most definitely want the technician to know how to get to the lift. Even if that technician is an adult.

I had to dismiss one guy because he was always shouting at his realtor about what he did and didn't want. It disrupted work for several weeks. When he lost his job, he was no longer able to buy a new house. He also was no longer able to disrupt work in my shop, which is what mattered to me.

Good work. So now you have a good example that everyone who owns a mobile phone is constantly using it to shout at his realtor instead of working. Because whenever you see something you don't like, you just know that everyone else is the same. All longhaired people are stupid. All with headphones are lazy. All with mobile phones spends their days doing private stuff.

Why not one day wake up and look around you and think: What can i learn today? What advantages could I get if I tried to use xxx?

List of 39 messages in thread
Keil problem...      Lukas Valecky      11/10/11 03:53      
   Kel support      Per Westermark      11/10/11 05:41      
      Keil support      Erik Malund      11/10/11 06:49      
         Reward for finding bug      Bert Van Den Berg      11/10/11 10:27      
            been tried      Erik Malund      11/10/11 10:51      
               public bug tracker      Maarten Brock      11/11/11 01:09      
                  It's not a KEIL-specific problem ...      Richard Erlacher      11/21/11 11:18      
                     not really      Maarten Brock      11/22/11 03:56      
                        It's those "snapshots" that I meant      Richard Erlacher      11/22/11 07:49      
                           Not true        Per Westermark      11/22/11 08:05      
                              Remember, where you sit determines what you see      Richard Erlacher      11/22/11 22:18      
                                 Concept      Per Westermark      11/23/11 02:11      
                                 I do not ...      Erik Malund      11/23/11 07:04      
                                    Comfort contra mobile phone      Per Westermark      11/23/11 08:30      
                                       Where you sit determines what you see ...      Richard Erlacher      11/24/11 00:58      
                                          You are still assuming you know what other people think/do        Per Westermark      11/24/11 02:49      
                                             You've overlooked the most basic fact ...      Richard Erlacher      11/24/11 16:31      
                                                Unuseful toy?      Per Westermark      11/24/11 17:18      
                                                   Once again, you've missed the point ...      Richard Erlacher      11/26/11 08:46      
                                                      Look for progress, instead of just looking back at history      Per Westermark      11/26/11 10:36      
                                                         are you that lucky?      Erik Malund      11/26/11 10:46      
                                                            Yes      Per Westermark      11/26/11 11:17      
                                                         Consider my position      Richard Erlacher      11/27/11 00:26      
      keil update      Lukas Valecky      11/10/11 07:47      
         auto variables      Per Westermark      11/10/11 08:24      
   Global Variable Initiaization      Michael Karas      11/10/11 06:40      
   just curious      Erik Malund      11/10/11 07:53      
      Always good to hide black-box data in structs      Per Westermark      11/10/11 08:19      
      Initialising array inside struct      Oliver Sedlacek      11/11/11 01:48      
         not necessarily      Jan Waclawek      11/11/11 02:10      
      Library      Lukas Valecky      11/11/11 05:00      
   New facts...      Lukas Valecky      11/11/11 06:35      
      At the very least use static for one-time initialized locals      Per Westermark      11/11/11 06:49      
         it works! thanks...      Lukas Valecky      11/15/11 11:36      
            Look at code in Debugger. It will tell all.      Michael Karas      11/15/11 12:19      
               It's called "Overlaying"      Andy Neil      11/15/11 15:00      
                  Optimization      Per Westermark      11/15/11 15:34      
      are you sure ...      Erik Malund      11/11/11 06:51      
   Thanks...      Lukas Valecky      11/21/11 10:55      

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