| Kai Klaas 06/10/05 17:43 Modified: 06/10/05 17:53 Read: 1225 times Germany Msg Score: +1 +1 Good Answer/Helpful |
#94648 - The scope plot tells it all! Responding to: Stanley Lio's previous message |
Hy Stanley,
from your scope plot, which I repeat here ![]() you can find every detail needed to design a successfully working circuit: 1. Find out why the base line of the plot isn't totally narrow. You can very clearly see noise on this base line, which is superimposed to your signal. Play a bit with the deflection settings of your scope to find out what this noise is. Then find out how you can mask it! Very probably a bandpass filter can be used to filter out anything which hasn't the same frequency as the transducer frequency. But take care, to me it looks like there are some older ultrasonic echoes superimposed to your actual echoe. So, you might have to make the time spacings between the ultrasonic bursts wider? 2. Have a look at exact frequency of ultrasonic signal. This will tell you the center frequency of your bandpass filter. 3. Have a look, how much the transducer signal changes in frequency from burst to burst. Take care, temperature changes can make your ultrasonic frequency undergo changes. This frequency range tells you how high the damping of your bandpass should be. I guess a Q of about 5 is adequate. If Q = 5 does not suffice to suppress noise enough, then two or more identical bandpass filters can be put in series. 4. Vary the distance of what is reflecting the ultrasonic burst. Look at the scope how much the signal amplitude will vary. I guess it will be a range of about 1 : 1/200, or so. Highly depends on the range of distance you will allow to be detected. This tells you the dynamic range of your signal and tells you where to set the threshold of your Schmitt-trigger. Also: (a) An AGC amplifier, which automatically controls the gain might not be a cure to your problem. Why? Just because the echoes are only lasting for a short period. Too short for most AGCs? More, if your signal is hidden in the noise, then an AGC amplifier will only detect the noise and nothing is gained. First of all, you must adequately pick out the signal from noise. (b) A Lock-in amplifier which is a phase sensitive detector will not work, because the phase of the echoed ultrasonic burst isn't predictable and isn't constant. Think about what happens if the reflector of ultrasonic burts wanders a bit: This will also change the phase of echoed ultrasonic bursts. Kai |
| Topic | Author | Date |
| Ultrasonic Signal Processing | Stanley Lio | 06/10/05 08:11 |
| Time dependant gain | Jez Smith | 06/10/05 08:29 |
| Further attenuation... | Andy Neil | 06/13/05 15:39 |
| Signal recovery. | Steve M. Taylor | 06/10/05 10:11 |
| AGC? | Stanley Lio | 06/10/05 19:25 |
| AGC as Steve said// | Payam Soltany | 06/10/05 10:49 |
| My Algorithm was: | Mehdi | 06/10/05 11:11 |
| My Algorithm was: | Mehdi | 06/10/05 22:08 |
| Ultrasonic Ranging | Mahmood Elnasser | 06/10/05 11:46 |
| Matched filter on the rescue | Enrique Viseras-marin | 06/10/05 13:25 |
| matched filters | Jez Smith | 06/10/05 14:36 |
| Phase locked amplifier | Steve M. Taylor | 06/10/05 15:04 |
| Its a different thing | Jez Smith | 06/11/05 01:41 |
| Ah | Steve M. Taylor | 06/11/05 05:35 |
| Thats the one.... | Jez Smith | 06/11/05 07:47 |
| Clever woman | Steve M. Taylor | 06/11/05 12:15 |
| Just an idea | Enrique Viseras-marin | 06/10/05 16:06 |
| The scope plot tells it all! | Kai Klaas | 06/10/05 17:43 |
| Largest signal | Stanley Lio | 06/10/05 19:24 |
| 'Greatest' echo is the wrong criterion! | Kai Klaas | 06/11/05 03:31 |
| | Stanley Lio | 06/11/05 03:47 |
| somehow I remember... | Stanley Lio | 06/11/05 07:47 |
| No, no... | Kai Klaas | 06/13/05 10:22 |
| Oops~ forgot... | Stanley Lio | 06/14/05 00:50 |
| the product | Stanley Lio | 06/10/05 19:40 |
| Power of transmission pulse | Mehdi | 06/10/05 22:41 |
| Preamp circuit Here | Stanley Lio | 06/11/05 03:52 |
| Add caps to remove base line noise | Kai Klaas | 06/11/05 03:58 |
| Another potential problem... | Musharraf Hanif | 06/11/05 06:32 |
| Problem with ADC? | Musharraf Hanif | 06/11/05 06:12 |
| possible solution to the ADC problem | Musharraf Hanif | 06/11/05 06:52 |
| Ok~ | Stanley Lio | 06/11/05 07:39 |
| Debug Result | Stanley Lio | 06/13/05 07:38 |
| ADC Sampling and code debugging | Mahmood Elnasser | 06/13/05 13:01 |
| sampling time | Stanley Lio | 06/14/05 00:53 |
| Adc for Ultrasonic? | Reza Javan | 06/14/05 01:22 |
| Next, comes to "average" | Stanley Lio | 06/20/05 21:05 |
| Why use the adc? | Russell Bull | 06/20/05 21:42 |
| Forgot to tell... | Stanley Lio | 06/21/05 00:07 |
| Circle in RED | Stanley Lio | 06/21/05 00:37 |
| Asking for help again - Filter | Stanley Lio | 06/22/05 05:20 |
| Notch | Steve M. Taylor | 06/22/05 06:05 |
| I don't know | Stanley Lio | 06/22/05 08:38 |
| DSP | Mahmood Elnasser | 06/22/05 14:38 |
| Nah | Steve M. Taylor | 06/22/05 14:39 |
| for the sake of learning | Mahmood Elnasser | 06/22/05 14:42 |
| so | Steve M. Taylor | 06/22/05 16:13 |
| I agree | Mahmood Elnasser | 06/23/05 00:13 |
| Amplitude | Stanley Lio | 06/22/05 20:23 |
| Op amps | Steve M. Taylor | 06/23/05 03:08 |
| 100pF | Stanley Lio | 06/23/05 07:32 |
| bypass ?? | Steve M. Taylor | 06/23/05 07:47 |
| Yes | Stanley Lio | 06/23/05 07:55 |
| No sort of bypass | Steve M. Taylor | 06/23/05 08:08 |
| BTE054 BTE054USS2 | Stanley Lio | 06/23/05 08:18 |
| Better noise control | Steve M. Taylor | 06/23/05 09:22 |
| re: BTE054 | Jacob Boyce | 06/23/05 13:29 |
| Replace LMV6032 with LM324 | Stanley Lio | 06/23/05 19:40 |
| re:low sensitivity | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 07:18 |
| re:no filtering | Jacob Boyce | 06/23/05 13:37 |
| Note | Steve M. Taylor | 06/23/05 14:27 |
| Notch filter? | Stanley Lio | 06/23/05 19:46 |
| No, | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 04:16 |
| Bandpass | Kai Klaas | 06/23/05 17:31 |
| NOT a criticism | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 04:19 |
| Update... | Kai Klaas | 06/24/05 07:02 |
| Umm... Nowadays? | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 07:15 |
| Op amp parameters | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 07:27 |
| "Filters for Dummy" | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 07:34 |
| Have you tried it with ..... | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 07:47 |
| Yes, I've tried it and it works well | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 09:58 |
| Basic electronics | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 10:06 |
| 0.002uF -> 3300uF | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 10:15 |
| re:noise | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 10:29 |
| Exactly the same | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 10:44 |
| test of signal | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 11:08 |
| It's over 1.2m | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 19:49 |
| TWO bypass caps. | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 11:05 |
| Two were found | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 10:47 |
| Usenet | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 11:17 |
| Why using a PLL, when a bandpass can ... | Kai Klaas | 06/24/05 11:06 |
| which is why ,,,, | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 11:13 |
| Not sure what you meant.. | Kai Klaas | 06/24/05 12:16 |
| Already | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 20:11 |
| But it MUST work properly!! | Kai Klaas | 06/25/05 04:21 |
| Circuit here | Stanley Lio | 06/25/05 05:45 |
| Op-amp to replace LM324 | Stanley Lio | 06/25/05 06:20 |
| Non-inverting Input Voltage Divider | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 06:08 |
| LM567 | Stanley Lio | 06/24/05 07:19 |
| re:LM324 | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 08:25 |
| re:wrong link | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 08:28 |
| No AGC | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 09:37 |
| AGC | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 09:48 |
| Yes | Steve M. Taylor | 06/24/05 09:51 |
| re: no AGC | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 10:10 |
| LMC6032 is much more linear than LM324 | Kai Klaas | 06/24/05 11:24 |
| re: | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 11:29 |
| re:attenuation of signal | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 11:42 |
| Good ones and bad ones | Kai Klaas | 06/24/05 12:23 |
| another article of interest | Jacob Boyce | 06/24/05 12:07 |
| tramsmit & receive | Reza Javan | 06/25/05 02:45 |
| how to measure the distance perfectly? | Pradono Antyanto | 06/26/05 08:26 |
| Fatal Error! | Mehdi | 06/26/05 09:25 |
| How about this one.... | Pradono Antyanto | 06/27/05 02:04 |
| Ultrasonic Detection Code! | Mehdi | 06/27/05 04:21 |
| is that right? | Erik Malund | 06/27/05 11:57 |
| Not right,,,,, | Michael Karas | 06/27/05 12:20 |
| Thanks! | Mehdi | 06/27/05 19:44 |
| another missing! | Mehdi | 06/27/05 19:55 |
| i'll try it.. | Pradono Antyanto | 06/28/05 05:08 |
| Some Applications of ultrasonic | Reza Javan | 06/25/05 02:49 |
| "Op amps for everyone" | Stanley Lio | 06/25/05 06:24 |
| woo... tiring trip | Stanley Lio | 06/26/05 04:55 |
| Check this one | Kai Klaas | 06/26/05 17:04 |
| Thanks | Stanley Lio | 06/26/05 19:52 |
| is it not fundamentally wrong | Erik Malund | 06/27/05 12:01 |
| Both | Stanley Lio | 06/27/05 18:09 |
| I knew that... | Kai Klaas | 06/28/05 05:16 |
| Synthetic grounds | Steve M. Taylor | 06/28/05 06:24 |
| no, Kai | Erik Malund | 06/28/05 06:30 |
| Steve, Erik | Kai Klaas | 06/28/05 07:05 |
| The circuit works, but... | Stanley Lio | 06/27/05 22:08 |
| Moral | Steve M. Taylor | 06/28/05 05:15 |
| Puh, what antennas... | Kai Klaas | 06/28/05 05:41 |
| Which means I can't use breadboard | Stanley Lio | 06/28/05 07:54 |
| In one word. | Steve M. Taylor | 06/28/05 07:55 |
| Using the LM318 | Stanley Lio | 06/28/05 22:19 |
| Missing 10K | Jerson Fernandes | 06/29/05 02:23 |
| More caps | Steve M. Taylor | 06/29/05 03:18 |
| Where? | Stanley Lio | 06/29/05 05:53 |
| Parallel | Jerson Fernandes | 06/30/05 06:37 |
| Does it work now? | Kai Klaas | 07/01/05 07:43 |
| Yes, it works fine | Stanley Lio | 07/02/05 02:26 |
| Theoretical work missed | Kai Klaas | 06/29/05 06:26 |
| Fatal Error! | Mehdi | 06/26/05 09:24 |
| Another article to peruse | Russell Bull | 06/27/05 01:19 |
| Another one... | Kai Klaas | 06/27/05 04:31 |
| same application | Mehdi | 06/27/05 06:47 |
| Sorry | Kai Klaas | 06/27/05 07:56 |
| Why sorry? | Mehdi | 06/27/05 08:31 |
| That's exactly what I want to do | Stanley Lio | 06/27/05 18:18 |
| which one is the best way? | Pradono Antyanto | 07/11/05 04:39 |
| Capacitors | Steve M. Taylor | 07/11/05 04:53 |
| i've got it | Pradono Antyanto | 07/11/05 05:10 |
| not the best solution | Benjamin Damet | 07/01/05 08:09 |
| Laser ranging | Steve M. Taylor | 07/01/05 14:59 |
| how much | Stanley Lio | 07/02/05 02:30 |
| I've withdrawn from the competition | Stanley Lio | 07/02/05 03:00 |
| NOT finance | Steve M. Taylor | 07/02/05 03:44 |
| Re: money is not everything | Stanley Lio | 07/02/05 09:38 |
| Good Luck | Raghunathan | 07/02/05 18:20 |
| good luck | James Hinnant | 07/03/05 00:58 |
| Good luck | Steve M. Taylor | 07/03/05 05:34 |
| Thanks! | Stanley Lio | 07/03/05 06:34 |
| The noise again | Pradono Antyanto | 07/12/05 05:01 |
| re:link | Jacob Boyce | 07/12/05 06:46 |
| Link | Stanley Lio | 07/12/05 09:20 |
| this is the link | Pradono Antyanto | 07/12/05 09:24 |
| re:noise | Jacob Boyce | 07/12/05 12:02 |
| 5-14 Khz | Pradono Antyanto | 07/12/05 12:56 |
| re:5-14kHz | Jacob Boyce | 07/12/05 13:02 |
| The Noise Amplitude | Pradono Antyanto | 07/12/05 13:13 |
| gain | Jacob Boyce | 07/12/05 14:19 |
| the problem is gain | Pradono Antyanto | 07/12/05 14:38 |
| Schematic | Kai Klaas | 07/13/05 17:29 |
| Thank You but... | Pradono Antyanto | 07/14/05 00:26 |
| Thank You but... | Pradono Antyanto | 07/14/05 00:36 |
| 1/4Watt is enough | Kai Klaas | 07/14/05 05:03 |
| Simulation result | Pradono Antyanto | 07/14/05 05:31 |
| Strange plots... | Kai Klaas | 07/14/05 07:09 |
| How about Compensation? | Pradono Antyanto | 07/15/05 00:24 |
| Not needed | Kai Klaas | 07/15/05 04:33 |
| Bigger Pulse | Pradono Antyanto | 07/30/05 05:35 |
| Bridge configuration can help | Kai Klaas | 07/30/05 10:46 |
| The same circuit but... | Pradono Antyanto | 07/30/05 22:52 |
| ...but much stronger | Kai Klaas | 07/31/05 05:02 |
| I have tried | Pradono Antyanto | 07/31/05 07:42 |
| What do you mean by ripple? | Kai Klaas | 08/01/05 07:37 |
| The ripple | Pradono Antyanto | 08/02/05 08:42 |
| No, it is not. The output from a logic | Erik Malund | 08/02/05 08:48 |
| Answer | Kai Klaas | 08/02/05 09:00 |
| Yup Kai | Pradono Antyanto | 08/02/05 09:06 |
| It's to adjust oscillating frequency | Kai Klaas | 08/03/05 07:10 |
Finished | Pradono Antyanto | 08/03/05 23:59 |
| Exams VS academic | Li Wk | 07/16/05 08:24 |
| "Plan B" | Stanley Lio | 07/17/05 05:09 |
| Universities in HongKong | Li Wk | 07/30/05 20:03 |




